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War on drugs???
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USA Legolas
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 15, 2003 1:53 pm   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


Okay since the War On Iraq thread is dying down, I figure, why don't I start a new crazy, totally unrelated topic. [Razz]

If any of you reading this are Americans. You'll get more out of it than others perhaps.

So have you been watching T.V. or listening to the Radio??? Well if you have I can bet you will have seen or heard a few commercials regarding anti-drugs. Sponsored by the partnership for a drug free America. LOL! [Big Grin]

Don't get me wrong here people. This Elf hasn't tried drugs; I haven’t even tried a cigarette. The only drugs I use are medical, caffeine, and Alcohol. And that last one I use maybe twice a month, which is very odd from where I hail from. [Roll Eyes]

The thing is that I have become VERY annoyed with these commercials. [Mad] So bothered that I want to go out and do drugs just to spite them. [Wink] Why am I soooo bothered by them? Because they are stupid; and sensationalized and it is getting to the point of becoming total crap. I don't know who these people think they are, but why do they think they can make "America" drug free??? IT IS IMPOSSIBLE.

Okay so we have that settled. Now lets ask a new question. WHY? WHY make "America" drug free. I understand for safety reasons (like truck drivers, and other dangerous jobs. Jobs that require clear judgment. ) But I only ask why because there is sooo much money in drugs. The government already knows this. Pharmaceutical companies know this. So why are they trying to go and make America drug free. Why not legalize all illicit drugs??? [Smile]

Well I am shocked! I always thought America liked money. It would be so great to see us come out of debt. I think this could be a road to do it. Plus it could make the numbers go down after a period of time. Its kinds like when your parent accepts the freak that you were dating just to get a reaction out of them. The coolness goes away. [Eek!]

Well kids I could ramble on for a bit longer but I'll stop and leave this open to discussion. Yvond's view should be interesting. [Big Grin]
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 15, 2003 7:20 pm   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


Well, i guess this depends on your definition of drugs. I believe they are trying to rid America of drugs like cocaine, meth, and all those, which I heavily support getting rid of down to my very bones. I've seen to many poeple ruin thier lives by using these.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2003 1:29 am   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


It is completely impossible to tell whether or not you're joking, Legolas.

"Let's legalize all drugs because there would be a lot of money in it!"

Are you being serious? The concept of a drug-free america should be dropped because it's stupid? Who do they think they are, trying to reduce the amount of illegal drugs in america?!

<jingly trumpeting theme!>

Welcome to the new America! A nation in which mind-altering substances flow freely and unregulated! And now, our new contestants (!):

From Skokie, Illinois: a dealer who murdered a stranger over a pound of cocaine!

From Muncie, Indiana: Three hopheads who routinely drop LSD, become agressive and kill their family members!

From Reno, Nevada: crack babies that are born addicted and won't live past 90 days!

From sunny Los Angeles: Four meth addicts who will rob, assault, and kill in order to satisfy their addictions!

All of these people are the wonderful, wholesome neighbors that you will share your streets with, thanks to the complete legalization of narcotics! If you thought there were a lot of them before, just wait until they can get their fix at the local Safeway!

But what am I saying? How could all my sarcastic humor hold any ground? If all these drugs were legal, none of these addicts would really be addicted, because since narcotics' abundancy would remove the novelty from illegal drug usage, then nobody would shoot heroin anymore and forget to feed their children. Since yes, we all know that if your parents pretend to not care when you do stupid shit, eventually you quit doing the stupid shit, since you were only doing it in the first place to be a "rebel" from your parents. That's why kids whose parents don't give a crap about raising them actually turn out *better* than those with parents who care. Yep. Sweet. Besides... all that anti-drug money is better spent on Pez, anyway. MMmmmmmmmmmm.... Pez.

I write all this desperately, desperately hoping that your entire post was really a colossal gag that I've fallen for, and you don't really believe anything that you said.

Thank you for being from Wisconsin.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2003 11:22 am   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


Okay I can see everyone is getting touchy feely about this like the Catholic Church. [Smile] Let me state that I am simply playing "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE". I am throwing out crap for evryone to have fun with, or to piss people off. Like you yak. [Razz]
quote:
posted 15 March 2003 10:29 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
It is completely impossible to tell whether or not you're joking, Legolas.

"Let's legalize all drugs because there would be a lot of money in it!"

<jingly trumpeting theme!>

Welcome to the new America! A nation in which mind-altering substances flow freely and unregulated! And now, our new contestants

Anywho, here is the thing. It would be regulated. thats one great thing that the gov could do. They could make things less potent, but pure. Making it safer. And drugs wouldn't flow freely. because the goverment could monopolize the industry like the post office. Lets face it, nothing with those cracks are free...

Now try to stay with me on this one true thing i belive, but not always follow. And that is "everything in moderation."

I hate to say it, but alcohol is a drug, and its dangerous, nicotine is drug, and very addictive.(you have seen the lame ass comercials, "tobacca is wacko -if you're under 18" these comericals should end. it says right on the package that IT WILL cause cancer, IT WILL cause heart didsease. It doesn't say maybe, it says it will,) Sorry bout that rant. where was I? Oh yeah. People abuse these drugs, just like all other drugs. Shit, food could be considered a substance, and when it comes to substance abuse, that is the most abused of all. More people die in this country from stuffing their fat ass more than dying from any other drug. And sadly that is a fact. [Eek!]

Here is another thing. Do you honestly think people will rob, or even kill eachother for drugs? Of coarse not! Why would they need to. It would be readily available, and cheaper. KEY WORD CHEAPER!!!! EASIER TO GET! SAFER!! [Smile]

(hey kids let be sure and read everything so that we get the full rounded point, lets not be like yak, and qoute part of this.) [Wink]
And when Zev when it comes to drugs, and people ruining their lives, I have seen more people screw up their lives because of alcohol than i have with the more illegal drugs. So what do you say. Should we get rid of the almighty bottle. or is it just a few dumbasses that ruin it for everyone else.

Maybe someone here is from Sweden. Then they could tell you how their country ellimintaed the drug problem.

Okay yak! here is where i was going to finsih. but now i will just go ahead and answere your freaking questiong, and your silly scenario's. [Roll Eyes]
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2003 11:58 am   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


quote:
thats one great thing that the gov could do. They could make things less potent, but pure. Making it safer.
Safe heroin? Safe MDA? mmmmhmmm. Oh... safER. So, like, LSD that doesn't make you kill your roommate, just maim him some.

quote:
because the goverment could monopolize the industry like the post office.

The post office is definitely doing a great job of monopolizing postal delivery services. What with keeping UPS, FedEx, DHP and everyone else out of business.... oh wait.

And how is the government going to monopolize the drug trade? If they can't stop it cold now, how are they going to prevent illegal non-government trading later?

INT. CRAPPY APARTMENT -- DAY

Stu and Dave, dirty and odius, lounge about.

STU
Hey, Dave, let's go get some drugs!

DAVE
Yeah... how about picking up some
Government brand dope at the corner
store?

STU
Aww, dude. Why would we buy that
"less potent and pure" stuff when
we could just talk to Knobber on
the corner and get the real dope
we always got before?

DAVE
True that, man, true that.

quote:
I hate to say it, but alcohol is a drug, and its dangerous, nicotine is drug, and very addictive.

Why do you hate to say those two things? They're both painfully true.

quote:
"tobacca is wacko -if you're under 18" these comericals should end. it says right on the package that IT WILL cause cancer, IT WILL cause heart didsease. It doesn't say maybe, it says it will,)
Have you ever, in your life, heard a thirteen-year-old worry about getting heart disease or cancer?

quote:
More people die in this country from stuffing their fat ass more than dying from any other drug.
Must ingest food to live. Must not ingest heroin to live.

quote:
Here is another thing. Do you honestly think people will rob, or even kill eachother for drugs? Of coarse not! Why would they need to. It would be readily available, and cheaper.
But then why do people kill each other over money? All they have to do is go out and get a job! Why do they rob and kill each other for dope now? All they have to do is pay fairly for it, and they wouldn't have to kill.

quote:
I have seen more people screw up their lives because of alcohol than i have with the more illegal drugs.
Wait wait. You said you have seen MORE people screw up their lives with booze? And booze is legal! So we should legalize drugs, and then there will be *fewer* people...? Booze legal... more people... drugs legal.....? Help me out there.

And yes, I am an American! I have no idea what they did in Sweden that solved all of their problems! But rather than learning Swedish, since you already know, what did they do in Sweden?

quote:
I am throwing out crap for evryone to have fun with, or to piss people off. Like you yak.
so what if I have fun getting pissed off? HaHA!

Hmm... too many quotes in this post.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2003 12:09 pm   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


Yak you dork you. [Smile] I wasn't done with my second post yet!!! I had to leave work. so at this time i was going to finish it. but you just gave me lots more amo. [Wink] But first let me finish my second then i'll get to this. one. in the mean time. stop posting!

And seriously way too many qoutes. it makes your post way too long, and repetitive.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2003 12:12 pm   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


That's fine, I'm on my way to work, too. So you have a good eight hours before I can post again [Big Grin]
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2003 1:56 pm   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


Holy shit man do you just hover on the computer???? Damn, I would like everyone to look up and see what time I had posted my second reply. 9:09, yak replied in three minutes! That is crazy. [Big Grin] but back to the point.

By the way thanks for the whole eight hours to reply. It is a nice added pressure. [Roll Eyes] Okay I have answered everyone of your questions in your previous post.

First off I would like to say that I think you are an extremist. And that’s scary, because I think you are not being open minded to the fact that there is a middle ground. Not every drug user is a crazy psycho who mauls people.

So can certain drugs be safe? YES! Everything in moderation is okay. Some of these drugs have been proven to be less addictive and harmful on the body than alcohol, cigarettes or caffeine.

There is a land called Sweden. America is a democratic republic, Sweden is a socialists Government, and that means they have really, really high taxes. But the government pays for everything. Like health care. Which is nice because they have a really low rate for unwanted pregnancies, low STD's and drug use. I don't know if people do, but they may look at them as having a high drug use rate. But that would only be because it isn't a closet activity like it is here. This brings me to the topic of what did they do with their war on drugs? Well they took out the under ground market, by simply having the health care program include drug addictions. (Now it is pretty nifty what chain of events this caused.) So lets say bob goes to the doctors and says, I have an addiction to heroin. Help me. The doctor gives him a prescription for it and he gets a free dose, as often as the doc thinks he needs it. And they slowly take him off the dependency for drugs. What has happened with this the way I hear is that most of the addicts that they had are sober. And since people are cheap by nature, they aren't paying some black market drug dealer, because they can get them for free. Of course here we would have to pay some money for it, or have insurance to help out. But because people are more open minded about drugs there. (And I don't mean that they are for it, but more understanding of why people do them.) They accept it when bob has to go get his fix, they don't make him feel ashamed for it because his other option (like here) would be to hold someone at gunpoint, or something else drastic to get the money to pay for his expensive drug habit. [Razz]

Okay on to post office VS. Fed Ex. The government still regulates all those business as well! And if you notice, priority mail is owned by the post office. So fed ex and UPS have competition. [Big Grin] my point being that, if you think other dealers would jump up as competition to the drug monoploy, the government would step in and still regulate.

You asked my "why do you hate to say it?" And that was referring to my blurb on alcohol and cigarettes being drugs. Well the reason I hate to say it is because there are people like you who seem to separate drugs. These drugs are okay how? I hate to say it, because so many people are hooked on these two, along with caffeine but think it is okay.

Okay next you decided to question me on the problem with those anti-tobacco commercials. Well I guess there is no problem, they just piss me off. You were right. Kids probably don't think about cancer or heart disease. But here's where I get bothered. I NEVER EVEN TRIED THEM. Why leggy did you not try this cool hip thing to do? Well because unlike most kids I had parents who paid some attention. They taught me about drugs. Tax money wasn't spent on commercials back then to teach me. Back then we relied on parents to be parents. No, no Yaky! Don't start getting me wrong. Brainwashing kids is wrong. Targeting them while they are young and immature is wrong. I agree with that. But lets let their parents or guardians educate them. Lets not bombard the public with all of this pain in the ass commercials.

NEXT! We discuss human nature. As in your little story with STU and DAVE, you seemed to have pointed to say that people would rather do something just plain stupid then safe. This makes me wonder if people would skydive without parachutes. [Eek!] The point is you are always going to have stupid people. And if anyone knows me, they know that I am pro evolution. And that means if they are that dumb to go and get a drug from an illegal dealer who could sell them un-pure, or even the wrong drug, use it find out they made a mistake, and then die. Well sorry they deserve it. I mean at least if the drugstore sold me the wrong drug, I could go get my money back, and at the very "extreme" sue them. But this argument is bunk because people do this now. I am talking about how less people would go and get them from some other crack head.

Booze! [Big Grin] Your statement about booze; well you misunderstood. I think it is a bad killer. And very dangerous, and that danger is doubled just like anything else when it is put into an unsafe environment. Like a car! And this goes for any drug. But why is drinking legal? Three Reasons; it has been around forever, most people only do enough to not hurt themself or anyone else, and finally because everyone does it for the most part. (So why isn't pot legal, many, many people do it.) Because it's not in the open.

Finally you said we need food to live, and we don't need heroin to live. Hmmmm...How do I handle this great amazing point??? Oh wait I know lets tell him that he didn't pay attention to the "everything in moderation" statement. Yeah I know I need food to live. Healthy food, and healthy portions, however, I do not need three triple cheeseburgers and coke with a side of fried potatoes to get by. Hey Yak, did you know you could get high on pure oxygen? Yeah you can, and guess what, you also need it to live! [Wink] does that mean it is okay???

In closing I will state my real opinion. And that is there will always be stupid ass people who are the "extremes". They ruin life for others, and because there is so much drama that comes with these crazy extremists, all the news will reports will be about them. Not once will you ever here, Billy Joe smoked some pot today, she then began to paint a picture, rode her bike and then had some sun chips. Its just boring.

I am all for letting the dumb kill themselves off. And if that means that the U.S. has to provide safe environments for them to do it in. Like a doctors office SO THEY DON'T HURT ME. Then so be it. Go government! woowhoo!

I do have a heart... My friend got silly while he was depressed and shot himself in the head with his deer rifle the summer after my senior year. Did I blame the drugs? Did I blame the NRA for allowing him to have a rifle? Hell no! I blamed it on him. Because in the end. We are all responsible for ourselves. And that’s why these anti-drug commercials bother me. I say let the dummies do it, just as long as they leave me alone.
[Big Grin]
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2003 4:10 pm   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


This was an interesting read, and its also interesting how every off-topic thread, at least recently, turns into an emotional car wreck. That being said, here is my take on the anti-drug commercials, and the suggestion to legalize them with moderation.

Even you leggy have to agree, legalizing drugs is a form of saying: drugs aren’t THAT bad, which is why we, the government, will now monopolize sales on them. This will result in an increase of users and addictions far above the already growing rate of new users, because hey, its now legal, its cant be that bad for you. The positive result of that, as you say, will be the decline of illegal drug traffic, gang violence, and safer drugs. I say, ok, drugs could become safer, with government policy on the content that goes in them. However addiction doesn’t work like that. You try one drug, and after a while u want a stronger drug, and that’s where the gangs will begin to resurface with “stronger underground drugs” And the whole cycle of violence, and gang problems will start again.

The commercials themselves I don’t mind at all. I think with a problem like drug addiction, especially at a young age, should be tackled every possible way. These commercials may seem corny to you, but to little 12 y/o Johnny, they’re speaking his language. I bet you these commercials have made a huge difference and this positive result far outweighs your annoyance with a “stupid” commercial.

O yea, and remember to have a good day.
[Big Grin]
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2003 5:23 pm   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


Hey thanks Eyedea. That last part was sweet. [Big Grin] Anyways, I think this has become an emotional car wreck because some people forget that I really could care less about this whole issue. I simply put it up for a nice taboo, controversial issue that will educate some, and piss off others. I think I have succeeded. [Wink]

Okay so maybe that would never work here in the U.S. I mean the people here are a little less mature than most of Europe. [Razz] They will become addicted and try and go for that stronger drug. But I feel the majority may come off of drug dependence. Call me Mr. Ideology. But I feel that it has worked there, maybe it could work here. And yes there are those stupid folks who would think that just because the government thinks its okay that it must be. [Roll Eyes] And some that would try it now just because its legal. But from my opinion, I would gladly let them screw up their lives. hell it gives me a better chance at making it in any job.

Just because its legal, doesn't mean I would do it. Cigarettes are legal, and I don't do them. Even pot, probably the most harmless of drugs, I wouldn't do. And that is what started me on this whole thread.

Look instead of these commercials educating parents, or kids about the really bad drugs. Or telling them how they can be distributed, or concealed. (This info would be for the parents.) They could also let people now the long term side effects. But what are they doing? They are simply focusing on marijuana. Now I just find that silly. The cigarette commercials I understand. I don't like them, but I understand. But the commercials with these kids smoking pot, and than leaving the drive thru and hitting a little girl is just a bit ridiculous. So if they want to air these commercials, then they better show these kids, drinking booze or beer. Because at least where I am from, that is most likely to happen. [Smile]

And hey, have a great day! Oh and by the way Yak. and the very end of your first post. what did you mean about the Wisconsin thing???
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2003 10:03 pm   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


Wow, Eyedea. I wish I could be concise like you. But I can't. Every time I touch a keyboard, two or three pages pop out.

And the Wisconsin thing just seemed funny... it sort of typed itself, and I laughed, so I left it in because it was absurd. Why did I crack on Wisconsin? No idea.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2003 12:32 am   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


Man... long post to reply to... so much babble...

Just to let you know, I skipped that whole Sweden thing, mostly because it pretty much just says that the government pays for rehab. Right? Great. And rehab is great, but you seem to forget that by far the vast, vast, VAST majority of those in rehab have to be forced into it. Rehab is also available in this country, you know. But, playing off your Sweden=socialized thing, it's not paid for by the feds, so it's tougher to force people into.

quote:
Not every drug user is a crazy psycho who mauls people.
Right! And not every gun owner is a crazy psycho who shoots people. But like with everything else, you have to worry about the crazies, not the cool people. Must I point that out?

quote:
Everything in moderation is okay.
I love blanket statements. Heroin in moderation is not okay. One hit gets you addicted. Cocaine in moderation is not okay. That's the whole point of an addiction. Once you're on it, it's no longer in moderation.

quote:
my point being that, if you think other dealers would jump up as competition to the drug monoploy, the government would step in and still regulate.
Dude. Why in God's name would an illegal crack dealer register with the government so that he could be regulated... when he could just not, and not pay taxes, and make more money?

quote:
people like you who seem to separate drugs.
I don't separate drugs. When did I say that cigarettes and booze were sweet? I think they're asinine. We weren't talking about either of them. click click click.... people like me.

quote:
Well because unlike most kids I had parents who paid some attention.
So... then... maybe... the commercials... are for people... who... don't?... have great... parental figures? Hmm. Let me think about that one for a while.

So why is drinking legal? Because, yay republic, if anybody introduced legislation to ban alcohol, it would get shot down quicker'n a French fighter pilot.

Eyedea smoothly pointed out that your annoying anti-drug television commercials are aimed at kids. Kids who may not have the excellent parents who raised you right and kept you from getting hooked in the first place. So those kids- who are too young to know any better- are they "the dumb ones"? The ones that should kill themselves off? Or maybe... JUST MAYBE... could we keep them from being the dumb ones, keep them from getting hooked in the first place... with stuff like TV commercials to partially replace the excellent parents you had that they don't? Think think think think....

We're all responsible for ourselves... or is a ten-year-old responsible for himself when he picks up a joint, has no idea what it is, and gives it a puff?

Lots of thinking to do, Legolas.

...I also completely buy in to having a good day. Hehe... French fighter pilot...
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2003 12:41 am   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


Words to the wise...

Don't give someone grief for taking less than 5 minutes to reply when you yourself took less than 10. [Smile]

Saying you don't really care about the debate you started is slang for, "Crap, I'm losing."

Calling someone an extremist is ill advised when you've stated, "Why not legalize all illicit drugs??? [Smile] " in the same thread.

And thank you for being from Wisconsin is a polite way of saying, "Thank you for not being from here."

Yeehaw to all and to all a good night.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2003 1:47 am   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


I protest. Caffeine is not a drug.
Caffeine is a way of life. [Big Grin]
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2003 3:17 am   Post subject: War on drugs??? Reply with quote


Leggy,

reading your posts I cant really figure out if you are joking or serious.

I can tell you from personal experience that there are no "safe" drugs. Not even the one given by your psychiatrist to counter the street one you use to take, it is still a drug and it still alters the way you think.

I had two friends who decided to be "cool" and try drugs. I sadly say that one is dead (at 19, isnt that "cool" to take drugs? and so safe?) after trying to stop and taking some "safe drug" and the other one is desesperatly trying to come off it in a rehab program.

I can also refer you to this intersesting article I found on Sky News yesterday: http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30100-12269917,00.html

Or this one, from BBC: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/2848489.stm

And mind you, it is possible to create a drug free society and to come off drugs and the best way to prevent people from taking any of this crap is by educating them what it exactly does and show them examples of what drug really does.

As Cal says, "my two cents". [Big Grin]

P.S: If you want some real truth of what drug really is, what it does and how it can be stopped, check this site: http://www.notodrugs-yestolife.com/
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